cathyr19355: Stock photo of myself (Default)
Add MemoryShare This Entry
posted by [personal profile] cathyr19355 at 12:11am on 10/11/2008 under ,
On Friday, [livejournal.com profile] esrblog upgraded the machines in the house, including mine, to the latest version of Ubuntu Linux, 8.10 (codenamed "Industrious Ibex", or something like that). He always upgrades our machines to the latest release because he feels a professional obligation to run the latest version, and since he is the sysadmin for all the machines in the house, having all the Linux machines in the house running the same version simplifies life for him.

I first suspected there was something wrong when I found him sitting in front of my computer on Friday morning, before I headed off to work, trying to figure out how to find the menu that would change my desktop wallpaper. I hung out for about 15 minutes, trying to help him find it--to no avail--before I had to leave.

By the time I got home he *had* found the wallpaper, and had also set up my taskbar to look as much as possible as it had before the upgrade. "I'm sorry, but the taskbar icons aren't movable, and won't be until the next release," he apologized. I found and installed a new wallpaper I liked. After our Friday night gaming session, I spent the rest of the evening figuring out where the file manager was. (It's now accessed from an icon at the far right of the taskbar; the icon on the far left of the taskbar, which used to take you to the file manager, instead gives you access to an index of your home directory. The directory list is useful only if you know the exact name of the file you want, and not if you expect to use the preview feature of the file manager to figure out which one you need).

I'm still trying to figure out how to tell KMail that it needs to open Firefox, not Mozilla, when I click on a URL in an e-mail message. (Apparently they've moved around the files I need to do that, too.)

Do you see why I'm annoyed? Don't get me wrong; most of 8.10 still does what I want it to do. KMail looks and acts mostly the way it formerly did. But... not entirely. And that's the problem.

The Kubuntu team is clearly obsessed with implementing the nifty cool features that are being implemented by Apple and MS, such as translucent windows that let you see your desktop through them as though they were made of tinted glass. ([livejournal.com profile] esrblog really digs that feature.) But in attempting to lure MS and Apple devotees by making Ubuntu *look* more like their favorite OS and office suite, they keep changing the location of files, and doing other things that change the way existing users have to *use* the software to get at features they like.

That's just wrong. Those of us who are not geeks but have other uses for computers want to be able to continue to *use* them, reliably, and not have to spend hours experimenting or searching through on-line forums to continue to use the same capabilities we've gotten used to after every single upgrade. Windows has the sense to do this, which may be why it's kept most of its customers despite their bitching; why can't Ubuntu?

I know I'm not the only user to detest this behavior. [livejournal.com profile] landley, who is a Linux geek, has gotten so annoyed with the small but annoying changes in how you have to use 8.10 that he's considering giving up on either the K suite or 8.10. "This shouldn't have to be this hard," he says.

He's right. It shouldn't. So why is it?

I think it's because the dev team for Ubuntu assumes, wrongly, that we users are more lured by the look of an office suite than anything else. That's wrong. What we want is to set up our computers to do the tasks we require, and be able to *continue* to use them reliably, without having to look in different places or learn a lot of different new commands and keystrokes.

We users may like cool visuals, but we *need* to be able to find the functions, features and applications we want. And we need to be able to continue to find them after each and every upgrade.

It's bad enough that Linux on the desktop is not making a lot of new friends. But if Ubuntu, the best surviving Linux, continues to alienate the users it has by screwing around with the nifty desktops it has already given them, they'll deserve the defeat they'll get.

To be fair to the Ubuntu team, they're not the only ones making this mistake. Google recently made the same type of mistake by capriciously changing the location of the subpage tabs for iGoogle from the side to the top. I don't mean just providing a new default location for the tabs. No, I mean changing the tabs permanently to the left-hand side of the screen, and refusing to give those of us who preferred the top tabs any way to change them back.

It's as if they're saying, "We're Google. We're cool. We don't have to care if you don't like it our way. We know what's best for you, and that's what counts."

Sigh. You don't make friends by giving people what they want, and then randomly taking it away, and I'd expected people supposedly dedicated to open source and what it means to understand that.
Mood:: 'disappointed' disappointed
There are 14 comments on this entry. (Reply.)
 
posted by [identity profile] nancylebov.livejournal.com at 08:21am on 10/11/2008
I'm surprised that they don't offer a "choose previous format" setting.
 
posted by [identity profile] landley.livejournal.com at 09:31pm on 10/11/2008
A) The KDE developers apparently didn't care about their existing userbase any more than Hans Reiser cared about people using Reiser3. (Before he murdered his wife, anyway.)

B) KDE 4.x actually _can't_ do a lot of the things KDE 3.x could. There's gobs of missing functionality.
 
posted by [identity profile] cathyr19355.livejournal.com at 02:21am on 11/11/2008
There's gobs of missing functionality.

I'm not trying to take issue with that. All I meant to say is that, from my perspective, most of what *I* expect from my desktop is still present. I wasn't speaking globally about Kubuntu or KDE's functionality. Remember, I make many fewer demands of my software than you do.

Which is why the KDE team should be worried, because if they're beginning to annoy people like me, who don't ask much and are pretty good at finding what they do ask for, in a basic office package.
 
posted by [identity profile] cathyr19355.livejournal.com at 02:17am on 11/11/2008
By "they" do you mean the Kubuntu team, or the iGoogle team? Or both?

That being said, I'm surprised myself.
 
posted by [identity profile] vakkotaur.livejournal.com at 01:11pm on 10/11/2008
I've been watching the reactions to the new KDE and have been grateful that the PCLinuxOS folks have decided to stick with KDE 3.5.x for now. Shifting files and control around without overwhelming benefit is a Bad Idea. Sadly, it seems many places are doing the Pet Idea thing of "I/We will do it Right This Time" without regard for their users.

I've never really understood the appeal of the transparent or translucent windows or the shower animations. Aren't we supposed to have fast, snappy computers now? So why slow them down to put on a show so we have to wait to do what what we want to do? That's one reason I went with PCLinuxOS instead of Kubuntu a couple years ago: I didn't have switch off as many annoying "kewl" misfeatures to get a tolerable desktop. I think it's "We'll attract attention with these kewl features" without the realization that if a person actually uses the product for longer than a review, the feature becomes an annoyance.

[livejournal.com profile] nancylebov nailed it. "Choose previous format" is the right answer to being able to show off the fancy schmancy new gimmicks - and then let users get back to something they like. While I haven't dealt with User Interface design in a big way, what little I have done has taught me that "You have to get it right the FIRST time, because all change will be resisted." (Unless there is an obviously overwhelming benefit - rare.) And that if there's any doubt about something, make it an option despite the work/pain/nuisance that an option is over a hard-coded setting.
 
posted by [identity profile] cathyr19355.livejournal.com at 02:26am on 11/11/2008
My objection isn't even to the features, kewl or otherwise; it's to changing the interface in ways that require the user to learn new ways to do the same old things.
 
posted by [identity profile] landley.livejournal.com at 09:28pm on 10/11/2008
> Windows has the sense to do this, which may be why it's kept
> most of its customers despite their bitching; why can't
> Ubuntu?

Ubuntu can. Kubuntu can't.

I'm not giving up on Ubuntu, I'm giving up on _Kubuntu_. I'm moving from the KDE version to the Gnome version, because despite my general dislike of Gnome KDE 4 has caused me to lose faith in the KDE developers. (I now understand why Ubuntu has defaulted to Gnome, if Shuttleworth saw this coming.)

I'll miss Konqueror, but it's their own darn fault for gluing it to KDE the same way Microsoft glued Explorer to Windows.
 
posted by [identity profile] cathyr19355.livejournal.com at 02:24am on 11/11/2008
I'm not giving up on Ubuntu, I'm giving up on _Kubuntu_

Noted. I stand corrected. Sorry about my misstatement of your position.

However, [livejournal.com profile] esrblog told me today that when he upgraded his laptop to 8.10, it lost its ability to do wifi. He doesn't know why, and he's already filed a bug report on it. That doesn't have anything to do with KDE, though, because he doesn't use KDE on his laptop, only Gnome.
 
posted by [identity profile] cathyr19355.livejournal.com at 07:21pm on 24/11/2008
Update: When we went to Philcon this weekend, [livejournal.com profile] esrblog re-installed 8.04, just to make sure he had wireless. He tells me that he's reported the wifi bug in 8.10, but has yet to get a response. Sigh.
 
posted by [identity profile] mirell.livejournal.com at 12:36am on 23/11/2008
Although, admittedly, in KDE's defense (Despite the fact I *despise* it) the Kubuntu effort seem far behind the Ubuntu effort, in streamling configuration. Ubuntu has a nice little System tab, and it's fairly easy to figure out how to configure printers, video resolution, et cetera from that. I couldn't figure it out without digging on Kubuntu.

However, I still just generally detest KDE, so yah.
 
posted by [identity profile] landley.livejournal.com at 01:55am on 23/11/2008
After my laptop hard drive died wednesday, my labeled "Kubuntu 8.04 x86-64" cd turned out to be the 32 bit version after all, so I bit the bullet and went to Ubuntu 8.10. Might as well get it over with.

I miss Konversation (pidgin's UI doesn't work for irc at all). I miss konqueror's ability to resize images in web pages without them going ridiculously grainy.

I'm still using kmail because I can't find _any_ other email program that can run a precommand and then grab messages from a local mbox file. (How hard is this to implement? Evolution can't do it, thunderbird can't do it, sylpheed can't do it, Mutt requires running a mail server on loopback which is not negotiable, and most of the others I looked at last had a release in 2002 or earlier...)

May wind up writing my own email program in python, which I do not look forward to, but this is _not_ a hard problem...

Rob
 
posted by [identity profile] cathyr19355.livejournal.com at 07:20pm on 24/11/2008
KMail is still crashing periodically for me (it seems to happen roughly after every three or four times I try to check in mail), but my worse problem, at this point, is the fact that my mail seems to be diverted or eaten sometime before even getting onto grelber. [livejournal.com profile] esrblog has made trying to get to the bottom of that his priority for today.

I still *like* KMail (or do when it isn't crashing), but I've never been crazy about the other applications in the K-Office suite. Except for KMail I mostly use non-KDE applications (Firefox for browsing, EMACS for editing webpages, OpenOffice for word processing, gthumb for photo editing, etc.).
 
posted by [identity profile] landley.livejournal.com at 10:09am on 25/11/2008
Did Eric ever sort out your mail?

Kmail and Konqueror are the only two I use, and I haven't currently got konqueror installed. I can get by with firefox, I just find many things it does annoying. It sucks mightily at scaling images, for example, and tends to freeze (to the point it won't even repaint) for 30 seconds at a time fairly often. These are mostly bugs rather than design flaws, I'm just kind of discouraged that coming up on its 10th anniversary the mozilla codebase is still this bloated and buggy. (Yeah, less than it was, but that's not an endorsement. I also note that firefox's spellchecker has underlined Kmail, konqueror, mozilla, codebase, and ironically enough: _firefox_.)
 
posted by [identity profile] cathyr19355.livejournal.com at 03:02am on 26/11/2008
Did Eric ever sort out your mail?

Unclear. See my most recent posts for updates. The short answer is he thinks that he did, but it remains to be seen whether that's really the case.

I know what you mean about Firefox freezing up. On the other hand, it crashes much less often than Konq used to for me. My browser is not giving me serious grief right now; my mail client is. :-(

March

SunMonTueWedThuFriSat
        1
 
2
 
3
 
4
 
5
 
6
 
7
 
8
 
9 10
11 12
 
13
 
14
 
15
 
16
 
17
18
 
19
 
20
 
21
 
22
 
23 24
 
25
 
26
 
27
 
28
 
29 30
 
31